Copywriting queen Margo Aaron is a wealth of business knowledge. Margo has taught thousands of students how to sell ethically, market honestly, and how to use words to stand out and inspire action. In this jam-packed episode, Margo and Conor discuss the rollercoaster of freelancing, hard learnings, the power of relationships, and the art and science of getting people to care.

Pete Shepherd is the 6”7’ founder of Human Periscope, co-host of The Long and the Short podcast and a head coach of Seth Godin’s altMBA, an online leadership and management workshop. Pete specialises in helping leaders around the globe to develop, grow and create great change by allowing them to see things they can’t. 


Jay Clouse is a writer, podcaster, and entrepreneur. Jay is the creator of Freelancing School, which provides the training and community to help people make a living freelancing. With three courses, coaching, and community support, Freelancing School has the tools to help creatives thrive as business owners.

Scott Perry is Creative on Purpose's Chief Difference-Maker and author of the Amazon top-sellers Endeavor and Onward. Scott is also the head coach for Seth Godin's Creative and Freelancer Workshops.

Scott has mentored and guided thousands of freelancers in helping them deliver work that is aligned with who they are and their key strengths, enhancing their own lives as well as the lives of others. In this episode, Scott shares with Conor his personal freelancing journey along with the key lessons he has learned throughout the adventure.

If I had just let some of those foundations myself in those early few years like my business would be in a totally different place right now like they're these are the old things that I'm like 2020 hindsight like those, those are the things that I would actually go back and change, quite painful to think about.

The power of habits in your business particularly when you're a one-person business, like a freelancer can completely turn your business around. It can help when you're lacking motivation, which happens to all of us when you're facing imposter syndrome, which happens with all of us. The power of habits can really, really drive your business forward.

Season 3 of The First 10 Podcast will focus on Freelancers, and this episode is a short message about why.

A recap of some of the incredible wisdom shared by my array of guests this last season, as well as mention a few things I'm working on right now.

And I think that a lot of really amazing art and design retailers and creators of products that are out there that have small businesses because of geographical restrictions or tech not serving them correctly. It's not right, and that problem needs to be solved.

The prerequisite you have to learn how to do that you have to stick it at doing the same thing. If you just like flitting around from marketing attempt to marketing attempt, or you know just doing it for two months and then not doing it for a while, I think you're just going to frustrate yourself and waste your time.

You may have 200 rejections, but the five or 10 that want to talk to you are people that have been thinking about the space long before you talk to them about it. And those are really the right people. And so if you get those type of investors, they're not going to ask you to focus too quickly.

That's the mistake a lot of people make when they're trying to get media in early stages. They just blast out what their product is product release. No one cares. No one cares what your product is literally no, not even your mom. No one cares. It's what's the story. And if you don't have that in your business, you need to find what that is.

Review of the First 10 Bootcamp and announcing the launch of the Freelancer Marketing Habit

You will be happier. And you'll find more success being really, really, really specific to target the exact type of customer. You want that as a need that your thing solves. And I think a lot of us, myself included, even you know, now after some years try to be something for everybody, and it's just not right. And like we all have to fight against that, I think.

“Customers, once they trust you with one thing, are potentially going to ask you to do many other things. But that’s where a lot of service businesses can get into trouble”

The “all or nothing fallacy” and Dan Pink’s To Sell is Human

“Don't frame your project as "research", instead tell your potential customer it’s up and running…and always be helping. It makes genuine business sense.”

I think you can get a customer with a decent looking website and a bank account, right? Maybe not even both people get lost in all the things they need to get a customer and it's like going to get a customer first and then you can figure out how to invoice them.

People seem to think that you have to have clarity before you take action. But it's exactly the opposite. In 99% of the cases I've seen, clarity comes from taking action and not the other way around, you don't have clarity and then take action. You take action, and then you get clarity.

“There are creative ways that you can either see if someone is willing to pay you, like put their money where their mouth is, or there are creative ways to actually get people to join in a journey with you, such as offering a discount, building a special feature for them with a pet project. There's so many ways to do that. And it's just going to serve you so much better in the long term, you'll be working on the right things”